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  1. #1001
    Quote Originally Posted by 1BGDOG View Post
    Because said underwear stops most of your shart from running down your leg... just like a mask stops a majority of your aerosol from getting out.
    Cause science.
    If you're wearing Huggies, maybe. Worn out and saggy tighty whiteys, not so much.
    Don't tell me violence doesn't solve anything.

    Look at Carthage.

  2. #1002
    Worse if you go commando, shoot goes every where.

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie G View Post
    If you're wearing Huggies, maybe. Worn out and saggy tighty whiteys, not so much.
    [SIZE=4]I don't even own a Jeep, oh wait I do and it is sick! [/SIZE]:P
    [URL]http://www.factcheck.org/[/URL]
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  3. #1003
    Real Estate Flippa Rex Ashton's Avatar
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    glad the thread itself is still withstanding

  4. #1004
    Real Estate Flippa Rex Ashton's Avatar
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    sorry, forgot the

  5. #1005
    creepycrawler's Avatar
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    Since someone doesn't like me to quote him, i won't quote him but since he claimed (cause science), i have to point out once again that science proves that the lil covids are too small for anything less than an N95 mask to stop and even that is nowhere near 100%.
    From the only state in the USA where O'dumbass failed to carry a single county. :hail:

  6. #1006
    The mask mandate should be replaced with the mask womandate.
    I started with nothing, and I've got most of it left.

  7. #1007
    So check this out....
    I know 2 guys who got COVID in the last 2 weeks.
    Both the same ageISH (early 50's)
    One works out a bit more than the other. But both in good shape overall.
    One guy got his butt kicked for 2 days and is back at it with 2 weeks off via his union.
    The other guy was DOWN for 7 days, like we thought he was dead, radio silence. And couldn't work.. out 2 weeks of work.
    This "cold" is crazy...

  8. #1008
    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    Since someone doesn't like me to quote him, i won't quote him but since he claimed (cause science), i have to point out once again that science proves that the lil covids are too small for anything less than an N95 mask to stop and even that is nowhere near 100%.
    So we should totally throw any mask mandate or effort(s) to limit the spread of this virus out the window.

    I will always remember this as a time when I, my wife, my 6 and 10yr-old children, and the overwhelming vast majority of my friends and family made the effort to err on the side of protecting themselves and those around them.

    And unfortunately I will always contrast those memories with those of all the people who couldn't muster enough empathy and care for their fellow humans to err on the side of protecting them.

    The use of masks of almost any type has been proven to help curb the spread of COVID. This has been done by people much, much smarter than you or I.

    I choose to err on the side of the smart people who are motivated by empathy. The people who don't want to see more people die.

    I don't care to try and understand the motivations of someone who lacks that empathy and is so selfish that they cannot do very simple, small things to protect those around them.

    - mike

  9. #1009
    It certainly has quite an adverse affect on different people. Kids may show little symptoms; even some adults.
    God Forgives, Rock's Don't www.ucora.org
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  10. #1010
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    So we should totally throw any mask mandate or effort(s) to limit the spread of this virus out the window.

    I will always remember this as a time when I, my wife, my 6 and 10yr-old children, and the overwhelming vast majority of my friends and family made the effort to err on the side of protecting themselves and those around them.

    And unfortunately I will always contrast those memories with those of all the people who couldn't muster enough empathy and care for their fellow humans to err on the side of protecting them.

    The use of masks of almost any type has been proven to help curb the spread of COVID. This has been done by people much, much smarter than you or I.

    I choose to err on the side of the smart people who are motivated by empathy. The people who don't want to see more people die.

    I don't care to try and understand the motivations of someone who lacks that empathy and is so selfish that they cannot do very simple, small things to protect those around them.

    - mike
    Your idea of proper empathy is not necessarily the same as mine. I guarantee there is someone out there that will accuse YOU of being not sufficiently empathetic because the habits you have adopted are not up to the other persons standards. Should you change what you are doing to meet the higher standard? Should everyone ratchet down to the most strict standard or risk being label "not sufficiently empathetic"?

    I dont have an answer to the question of what is right. My gut tells me we are way over on the crazy overprotective end of things where we are wasting time, effort and money to make very little additional safeguard. But I don't have scientific backup for that feeling/opinion. Regardless, I try very hard to stay away from strangers and wear a mask when appropriate. Not sure how that discussing the science around masks instantly ties to a lack of morals, empathy or care for our fellow man. Using the hard hammer of social justice anytime a discussion is raised does nothing toward finding improvements in our lives. And I mean that in regard to increasing or decreasing the level of protection. If the right answer is to increase masking, but you instantly shut down any discussion because it isnt socially acceptable, then how do we identify that the current masking rules are insufficient?
    Proudly un-offended.

  11. #1011
    Quote Originally Posted by Clod Hopper View Post
    My gut tells me we are way over on the crazy overprotective end of things where we are wasting time, effort and money to make very little additional safeguard.
    Several hundred thousand dead people and their families would like to have a word with you about how we're wasting time, effort, and money.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clod Hopper View Post
    If the right answer is to increase masking, but you instantly shut down any discussion because it isnt socially acceptable, then how do we identify that the current masking rules are insufficient?
    Because, overwhelmingly, "discussion" on this thread and outside of this thread always veers into skepticism towards additional safety and I can't recall reading or hearing anyone saying to themselves "my god - do you think we've done enough? surely we can do more to stop this pandemic".

    If this thread, and most conservative discussion around COVID ran more along the lines of wanting to do more rather than shamefully referring to several hundred thousand dead people as a "scamdemic" then I'd be super open to discussion. But since it's not, I think the level of discourse around this should be something along the lines of telling your toddler to go to their room and leveraging shame in hope that they might learn a lesson here - because that's exactly how the world has seen conservatives in the US up to this point. As whiny, entitled little toddlers who really, desperately need someone to come tell them to STFU.

    - mike

  12. #1012
    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    But since it's not, I think the level of discourse around this should be something along the lines of telling your toddler to go to their room and leveraging shame in hope that they might learn a lesson here - because that's exactly how the world has seen conservatives in the US up to this point. As whiny, entitled little toddlers who really, desperately need someone to come tell them to STFU.

    - mike
    Same exact statement applies if you change the word "conservative" in your discourse above to "liberal" or "progressive".

    Goes back to a line from Cool Hand Luke. "What we have here is a failure to communicate". Both sides of the political/mask/social justice/whatever debate you want to have are saying that their way is the right way and stomping their feet to make that point. Both sides pretend that they want to communicate, but neither one really does effectively communicate. No one takes the time to listen and understand, mostly because each side tries to make their point with volume and anger rather than rational conversation. Mostly it devolves to name calling and various tones of derision.

    It's pretty much every issue, in my opinion. And both sides. At the local level, state level and all the way to Washington. Both sides of all of these issues need to be cured of their cranial-rectal inversion and re-learn how to be civil and be part of the solution and not part of the problem. The divide that this country is seeing will continue to grow until 2 people--one on each side of the issue--have the guts to start working toward a solution together instead of continuing to struggle apart.

    I'll step off of my soapbox now.
    '96 Grand Cherokee with stuff done to it.

  13. #1013
    creepycrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    So we should totally throw any mask mandate or effort(s) to limit the spread of this virus out the window.

    I will always remember this as a time when I, my wife, my 6 and 10yr-old children, and the overwhelming vast majority of my friends and family made the effort to err on the side of protecting themselves and those around them.

    And unfortunately I will always contrast those memories with those of all the people who couldn't muster enough empathy and care for their fellow humans to err on the side of protecting them.

    The use of masks of almost any type has been proven to help curb the spread of COVID. This has been done by people much, much smarter than you or I.

    I choose to err on the side of the smart people who are motivated by empathy. The people who don't want to see more people die.

    I don't care to try and understand the motivations of someone who lacks that empathy and is so selfish that they cannot do very simple, small things to protect those around them.

    - mike
    Thanks for that well thought out reply and i am happy to give you my thoughts on it.

    First off, and i do not want to turn this thread political so maybe we can discuss some thoughts in a different thread but i believe that they are germain to the conversation about covid. For one, and you haven't said it i don't believe but some that have been in this conversation keep throwing out sarcastically that covid is "a cold". Yes, i know that Trump says some stupid things but at the time he was saying those things, it is my belief that all he was doing was trying to calm the country and the panic that was ensuing. I don't think that is a bad thing. As a matter of fact, when he was making those statements was well after he attempted to shut down flights from China and other places to try to prevent the covid from getting here but this effort was blocked as being racist.

    He then came out with a plan on shutting down parts of the country to which certain governors said no you aren't. We will govern our states as we see fit and Trump allowed that to happen yet everything is still blamed on him. Again, Trump was far from perfect but he let governors rule over this as they wished.

    Lastly on the political front, every Trump supporter in the country has been accused of thinking that the covid is fake. While i know those are out there, they are the slim minority and the radicals.

    On to the masks. You state that there are studies that prove that practically and type of mask will prevent the spread. I have not seen that although i am not saying they are not out there. What i have seen are a few studies showing the opposite including at least three that have been posted in this thread including the one from a Doctor at the Mayo Clinic explaining the N95 mask and its effectiveness.

    He goes on to state that the N95 masks will filter right down to the size of a lil covid. He states in the study the range of sizes of the lil covids although i don't remember what they were now but either way, 95% of the covids are just large enough for the N95 mask to catch while 5% of the lil covids are just under the size that the N95 mask can stop. That 95% ratio is where the N95 mask gets its name but.... and this is a big but, in order for the N95 mask to stop 95%, it has to be put on correctly. It has to be worn correctly. And it has to be taken off correctly.

    If an N95 mask can only stop 95% (which is good) ONLY when under those conditions, it doesn't take a whole lot for me to believe that all of the lesser "masks" of whatever kind that people are putting on and taking off touching the inside and outside of them every time they put them in or take them out of their purse or pocket are doing nothing and its high questionable if the lesser "masks" do much if anything even if worn perfectly.

    I am logical to a fault i guess. When the whole ( you should wear a mask not to protect yourself but to protect others) phrase got started and more than a few came right out saying the wearing a mask would not keep you from getting a helping of the covids but it would keep others from getting the covids, that just topped it all. This isn't logical AT ALL. We are truly supposed to believe that the little covids can get through the mask from the outside world and make you sick but the exact same lil covids can't make it from the inside of whatever mask to the outside world? I don't think so.

    I have never tried to act like i am some kind of badass because i don't wear a mask nor have i ever denied that the covid is real and it can be real bad. The fact is that nobody at work wears a mask and few of our customers do. A couple of guys at work have had it. One is in his mid-sixties and he got bad enough that he had to go to the hospital and get plasma and he was fine a few days later. The other was a 17 year old who's whole family had it but none bad at all. I also know a couple people who have died from it.

    In the end, i go back to what i have said from the beginning and have repeated more than once. Unless you want to hole up in your house and live in a bubble, you are going to be exposed to it. You might catch it. You might not. You may not even know you had it or you may die or anything in between those two and i just flat don't believe that wearing a mask is going to change that one bit.

    If you believe that wearing a mask will keep you safe or keep others safe then by all means, wear it with no judgements by me but i just don't and this brings me to the one statement that you made that i take issue with. Forgive me if i don't quote this perfectly but you said something to the effect that you prefer to take advise from "smart people who's decisions are based on empathy".

    Empathy is a very good trait to have and i do have empathy. I have empathy for everyone in the country who has been handed a terrible ordeal be it from loss of family members to loss of jobs and i realize how lucky i have been not missing a single day of work because of this disaster. I have empathy for all of the people governing this great nation and the pressure they have gone through just trying to do what is best with the knowledge they have at that time with things changing constantly.

    I do not belive that wearing a mask just for the sake of making others who think they are being saved by you wearing a mask is empathy. If i was going to go to someones house who believed that a mask would save them, i would wear a mask but that is about it.

  14. #1014
    Captain Radon Steve's Avatar
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    It’s been my observation in this and at least one other current thread here that the majority of demeaning, insulting and condescending posts, including some that were deleted in this one for crossing the line, are from liberals - who proclaim that all conservatives are hateful. Things that make you go hmmm...

    Carry on. Civilly.


  15. #1015
    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    Lastly on the political front, every Trump supporter in the country has been accused of thinking that the covid is fake. While i know those are out there, they are the slim minority and the radicals.
    Aside from that one time that the President himself referred to COVID as a Democratic hoax. Your claims of "slim minority and radicals" falls on deaf ears over here.

    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    You state that there are studies that prove that practically and type of mask will prevent the spread.
    I mean when like entire countries have embraced massive efforts to limit physical interactions and have stringently enforced mask wearing, and then they ended up having a much lower death rate than the US - this no longer becomes an academic debate or an exercise of pointing to studies about N95 masks or whatever. People are dying or they're not dying based on how they and the societies that they live in are handling the pandemic. Really, there is zero need to talk about some lab or doctor somewhere when you can look at THE ENTIRE COUNTRY OF NEW ZEALAND who got their shit together and did the right thing based on facts and not beliefs.

    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    i just flat don't believe that wearing a mask is going to change that one bit.
    What's really cool about facts is that facts don't care about whether or not you believe in them. The facts are really, actually, against you on this one. And there's no need to debate your side because there's no debate on the facts of what can be done to slow or stop the spread of COVID.

    But what's great about beliefs is that no one should take them away from you. You're totally cool to have your beliefs on this. You do you. Again, no need to debate your beliefs because you should be able to hold your beliefs close and that's that.

    But you're talking about the intersection of

    your belief that wearing a mask isn't going to change the transmission rate of COVID

    and

    the fact that wearing a mask does reduce the transmission rate of COVID at least to some degree with less-effective masks and to a high degree with more effective masks but its undisputed by every single reputable source of information on COVID that covering your mouth and nose in some way, any way will help reduce rates of transmission and that this has been proven out not in labs but in entire countries by millions of people who aren't screwing around debating N95 vs. cloth vs. whateverthehell

    and consequences get a bit more serious for your actions. Really, I'd like to think that most human beings would think to themselves

    "You know what? On the off chance I could be wrong, and wearing a mask could keep others around me safer, even if I'm not concerned for my own health, I'mma wear a mask so that I can help contribute in my small way of keeping people around me safer. It's a total outside chance, and it's a super small gesture, but really it's not an inconvenience that outweighs my desire to see people around me be safe."
    ...but all too often that's not the case.

    - mike

  16. #1016
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    are from liberals - who proclaim that all conservatives are hateful. Things that make you go hmmm...
    Hey Steve, when you start policing things like "libtard" you'll get some credit for taking the high road.

    - mike

  17. #1017
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    And there's no need to debate your side because there's no debate on the facts of what can be done to slow or stop the spread of COVID.

    - mike
    So you came here simply to troll. Hell, that was evident in your first response.

  18. #1018
    Quote Originally Posted by ASCTLC View Post
    So you came here simply to troll. Hell, that was evident in your first response.
    OMG the nuclear option: labeling someone as a troll. How late-90's AOL chat rooms of you.

    Pretty lame that you chose not to quote me in more context:

    What's really cool about facts is that facts don't care about whether or not you believe in them. The facts are really, actually, against you on this one. And there's no need to debate your side because there's no debate on the facts of what can be done to slow or stop the spread of COVID.

    But what's great about beliefs is that no one should take them away from you. You're totally cool to have your beliefs on this. You do you. Again, no need to debate your beliefs because you should be able to hold your beliefs close and that's that.
    No need to debate beliefs about my troll status either.

    - mike

  19. #1019
    Captain Radon Steve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    Hey Steve, when you start policing things like "libtard" you'll get some credit for taking the high road.

    - mike
    Unlike some here Mike, I don't proclaim to take the high road. I don't do a lot of policing here either, but will say if you saw the posts I deleted you'd understand my observation, which is what you partially quoted. I'm not the insult police, but I will get involved when things get nasty, which was what happened earlier in this thread.

    I don't always agree with someone, particularly on some political topics and the response to this pandemic, but I will listen and not insult them simply because I disagree with them.

  20. #1020
    creepycrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    Aside from that one time that the President himself referred to COVID as a Democratic hoax. Your claims of "slim minority and radicals" falls on deaf ears over here.
    Well let's see. The country is about as evenly split as it can possibly be. There are 328 million people in the US so that puts roughly 164 million in the Trump camp. How many rioters and looters and cop killers and assaults have there been over the last few months that liberals praised and urged on?

    Now how many idiots actually invaded the House last week? I honestly don't know but what, maybe 50 on the high end and i will even give you that they were all actually Trump supporters.

    Let's see, 50 out of 164 million...ish.

    Your thinking that the nut cases are a majority of the right doesn't add up to me.

  21. #1021
    Interesting interview, well worth the 20 minutes, IMHO:


  22. #1022
    creepycrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    I mean when like entire countries have embraced massive efforts to limit physical interactions and have stringently enforced mask wearing, and then they ended up having a much lower death rate than the US - this no longer becomes an academic debate or an exercise of pointing to studies about N95 masks or whatever. People are dying or they're not dying based on how they and the societies that they live in are handling the pandemic. Really, there is zero need to talk about some lab or doctor somewhere when you can look at THE ENTIRE COUNTRY OF NEW ZEALAND who got their shit together and did the right thing based on facts and not beliefs.
    I will admit that i am not well versed on what countries have done better than others so since you seemed proud of New Zealand, i took a google look at it because i wasn't going to sign up to whatever website that you posted the link to.

    It does look like New Zealand has done an awesome job of it. I didn't see anything specifically regarding mask requirements but i assume they were in place. It looks like they did two things to help themselves out and accomplish what they have done so far.

    To begin with, they shut down people coming into their country right off the bat. Trump also attempted to do that with most likely carrier countries right off the bat was was shot down by the democrats who hailed it as racially motivated.

    Next, they shut the entire country down for an extended amount of time. As i already pointed out, Trump was going to make the shut down rules and again, was overrun with complaints from who? Democrat governors who stated that Trump didn't have the authority to do that and that they would set shut down rules themselves which Trump went along with. Did Trump do better than anyone else in his shoes could have done? I don't know.

    Ok, back to New Zealand which is apparently your go to on this. I don't know what kind of government runs this country but i hope they were able to dole out more than a couple thousand dollars to everyone there during the lengthy shut down and this goes back to Trump saying that we can't make the cure worse than the disease.

    I am glad New Zealand has come through it better than most but seriously, you are talking about a country that is very close to the size of Colorado and has a million less people than Colorado. I am just guessing that it is going to be somewhat easier to manage a crises like this there than here.

  23. #1023
    creepycrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    What's really cool about facts is that facts don't care about whether or not you believe in them. The facts are really, actually, against you on this one. And there's no need to debate your side because there's no debate on the facts of what can be done to slow or stop the spread of COVID.

    But what's great about beliefs is that no one should take them away from you. You're totally cool to have your beliefs on this. You do you. Again, no need to debate your beliefs because you should be able to hold your beliefs close and that's that.

    But you're talking about the intersection of

    your belief that wearing a mask isn't going to change the transmission rate of COVID

    and

    the fact that wearing a mask does reduce the transmission rate of COVID at least to some degree with less-effective masks and to a high degree with more effective masks but its undisputed by every single reputable source of information on COVID that covering your mouth and nose in some way, any way will help reduce rates of transmission and that this has been proven out not in labs but in entire countries by millions of people who aren't screwing around debating N95 vs. cloth vs. whateverthehell

    and consequences get a bit more serious for your actions. Really, I'd like to think that most human beings would think to themselves
    What is really cool about this is that i have pointed out actual scientific studies that can be found in this very thread which in part, have led to how i think. You are absolutely correct that facts don't care what you think but they do determine what you think.....hopefully.

    I have read studies that basically tell a story that wearing a mask does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid and the only thing you come back with is "well its a fact". I am completely open to debate on this but saying that other countries have done better is a non-argument. If strict face mask rules fix the problem, how come some of the strictest governed states in the US as far as wearing masks go are in the shape they are in with covid?

  24. #1024
    Key takeaway don't be "mean" or seen as a "libtard" may upset some
    Last edited by 1BGDOG; January 14th, 2021 at 08:20 PM.

  25. #1025
    Quote Originally Posted by Willie G View Post
    Interesting interview, well worth the 20 minutes, IMHO:

    At best, this is a really badly timed joke, and a really un-funny joke at that. I'm very thankful that the people in charge of prosecuting these right-wing terrorists aren't taking anything like this seriously.

    - mike

  26. #1026
    "At best, this is a really badly timed joke, and a really un-funny joke at that. I'm very thankful that the people in charge of prosecuting these right-wing terrorists aren't taking anything like this seriously."

    - mike


    It will all likely happen in D.C. so you can't be sure of anything.

  27. #1027
    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    Ok, back to New Zealand which is apparently your go to on this.
    Nope - my go-to on this is the overwhelming amount of evidence presented by people who study stuff like this for a living, and how many other countries (Vietnam, Singapore, Niger, Ghana, Cuba, South Korea, Venezuela, United Arab Emirates, Indonesia, Finland, Denmark, Greece, Ireland, Germany... omg there's so many) have lower COVID-related death rates than the US.

    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    I have read studies that basically tell a story that wearing a mask does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid and the only thing you come back with is "well its a fact".
    Right - because at some point, these things come down to actual facts. I'll totally give you that you can never be 100% certain of a fact, but you can work hard to get damn close and not a single study or opinion against masks in this thread has reached the "work hard to get damn close" level.

    So facts are cool, but the way we get really close to facts in the scientific and medical field is even cooler. It's through peer review. Where someone presenting a study that says that wearing a mask "does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid" releases their study for wide review by the highly-educated scientific community as a whole, and is given a chance to defend their theories and rebut criticism of their methods. And if it holds up to that scrutiny, it can be incorporated into things like public policy.

    There isn't a single study that you can point to that reaches that level of double/triple checking and peer review that successfully argues that "wearing a mask does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid" or any other airborne contagion. No a single one of the studies previously brought up in this thread is any better than the study that Jenny McCarthy used to spread lies about how vaccines cause autism. Actually, most of them don't even rise to the level of that study, which was obviously eventually shot down, proven wrong, all that good stuff that scientists do when presented with bullcrap.

    The thing that's funny, is - that scientific method is how we've gotten to the point where we our lives are so much safer, our lifespans are so much longer, and basically we're so much better off than our ancestors in most every way. And what do people do? Use that resulting leisure time to crap all over the same scientific method that helped get them where they are today. Yay, humans.

    - mike

  28. #1028
    Captain Radon Steve's Avatar
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    Huh, look there, a peer-reviewed study by the U.S. military, published in the New England Journal of Medicine, that says Even a Military Enforced Quarantine Can't Stop The Virus, Study Reveals. But yeah, wearing a piece of cloth or paper of any kind on your face will.

    Facts are such pesky things.

  29. #1029
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    Nope - my go-to on this is the overwhelming amount of evidence presented by people who study stuff like this for a living, and how many other countries (Vietnam, Singapore, Niger, Ghana, Cuba, South Korea, Venezuela, United Arab Emirates, Indonesia, Finland, Denmark, Greece, Ireland, Germany... omg there's so many) have lower COVID-related death rates than the US.



    Right - because at some point, these things come down to actual facts. I'll totally give you that you can never be 100% certain of a fact, but you can work hard to get damn close and not a single study or opinion against masks in this thread has reached the "work hard to get damn close" level.

    So facts are cool, but the way we get really close to facts in the scientific and medical field is even cooler. It's through peer review. Where someone presenting a study that says that wearing a mask "does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid" releases their study for wide review by the highly-educated scientific community as a whole, and is given a chance to defend their theories and rebut criticism of their methods. And if it holds up to that scrutiny, it can be incorporated into things like public policy.

    There isn't a single study that you can point to that reaches that level of double/triple checking and peer review that successfully argues that "wearing a mask does not decrease the probability of you getting sick by covid" or any other airborne contagion. No a single one of the studies previously brought up in this thread is any better than the study that Jenny McCarthy used to spread lies about how vaccines cause autism. Actually, most of them don't even rise to the level of that study, which was obviously eventually shot down, proven wrong, all that good stuff that scientists do when presented with bullcrap.

    The thing that's funny, is - that scientific method is how we've gotten to the point where we our lives are so much safer, our lifespans are so much longer, and basically we're so much better off than our ancestors in most every way. And what do people do? Use that resulting leisure time to crap all over the same scientific method that helped get them where they are today. Yay, humans.

    - mike
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    Huh, look there, a peer-reviewed study by the U.S. military, published in the New England Journal of Medicine, that says Even a Military Enforced Quarantine Can't Stop The Virus, Study Reveals. But yeah, wearing a piece of cloth or paper of any kind on your face will.

    Facts are such pesky things.
    Dohhhhh!!!!

  30. #1030
    Quote Originally Posted by creepycrawler View Post
    Dohhhhh!!!!
    Why link to the article that discussed the study rather than the study itself? Oh because you have to rely on the spin of another website to present the supposed facts of the actual study as published?

    So here's the CONCLUSIONS section of the study:

    CONCLUSIONS
    Among Marine Corps recruits, approximately 2% who had previously had negative results for SARS-CoV-2 at the beginning of supervised quarantine, and less than 2% of recruits with unknown previous status, tested positive by day 14. Most recruits who tested positive were asymptomatic, and no infections were detected through daily symptom monitoring. Transmission clusters occurred within platoons. (Funded by the Defense Health Agency and others.)

    Uh - and then the discussion part goes into (my emphasis)

    Although many infected recruits in both clusters had nearby room assignments and shared a bathroom, the epidemiologic analysis suggests that platoon membership and double-occupancy rooming were risk factors for infection, but room proximity and shared bathrooms were not.
    You see - these recruits WERE NOT ISOLATED FROM EACH OTHER AMONG THEIR PLATOON and the study goes into great length to describe the different genomic strains that were actually found to have been transmitted between recruits within the platoon rather than focus on vectors of that transmission. Platoons were separated but again, as stated in the study when recruits shared rooms:

    Our study showed that in a group of predominantly young male military recruits, approximately 2% became positive for SARS-CoV-2, as determined by qPCR assay, during a 2-week, strictly enforced quarantine. Multiple, independent virus strain transmission clusters were identified. Shared rooms and shared platoon membership were risk factors for transmission. Most study participants with positive qPCR tests were asymptomatic, and all cases among participants and nonparticipants were identified as the result of scheduled testing rather than clinical qPCR testing performed as a result of daily screening.
    Again, my emphasis. And the study wasn't testing the effectiveness of masks, that wasn't even brought up anywhere in the conclusion and discussion of the results. Holy wow how did you miss that, Steve? It's almost as if, when you let people share the same physical space, that shows up as a risk of transmission of COVID. And when you keep groups of people separate, the virus doesn't jump between the two groups. Here's my shocked face.

    Yeah - this is only one of the of the reasons why secure facilities (like the one I've been working in for the last 6yrs) have physically separate areas to keep personnel separate. That's why our facility has not been closed down once and why there haven't been any outbreaks among our employees as we support our mission. Oh? And I get to wear a mask all the damn day whether I'm alone or not - but I do because, well, I think of mine and my family's and others' safety when I leave my house and it's a f'n easy thing to do that most likely benefits us all and I'm not selfish and kind of a snowflake about the whole thing.

    Gah, read the study yourself. Not the article that read the study for you.

    - mike
    Last edited by sweater; January 14th, 2021 at 11:44 PM.

  31. #1031
    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    you can never be 100% certain of a fact
    I have no desire to engage in your bat shit crazy conversation but the above quote is just plain stoopid. Things are only facts if you CAN be 100% certain, anything less than 100% is a theory.

    Cary on with you intolerant ranting
    " A mans rights rest in three boxes; the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box" Fredrick Douglass
    "The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them" George Orwell

  32. #1032
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweater View Post
    It's almost as if, when you let people share the same physical space, that shows up as a risk of transmission of COVID. And when you keep groups of people separate, the virus doesn't jump between the two groups.
    Exactly! You figured it out! The funny thing about it is that the exact same thing happens whether or not you wear a mask.

  33. #1033
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    Quote Originally Posted by Willie G View Post
    Interesting interview, well worth the 20 minutes, IMHO:

    Didn't watch the video but I see a BLM activist named John Sullivan was arrested for his part at the capitol.

    He tried telling the FBI he was a journalist, there to document, but his own video shows he was provoking the actions saying "let's go" and "we'll burn this shit down!".

  34. #1034

    One year ago, Jan 14, 2020

    The World Health Organization said:

    “Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in Wuhan, China.”

    W.H.O. chief Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, who is not a medical doctor, has not been impeached.


    https://www.breitbart.com/europe/202...-transmission/

  35. #1035
    Quote Originally Posted by SamFromCO View Post
    The World Health Organization said:

    “Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in Wuhan, China.”

    W.H.O. chief Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, who is not a medical doctor, has not been impeached.


    https://www.breitbart.com/europe/202...-transmission/
    "Preliminary investigations" from the first months of this pandemic.

    Yup, we should totally go with holding these people to their preliminary investigations and discard everything else that has been learned since then.

    Anything to fit your narrative,
    mike

  36. #1036
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    ^^^ "Trump didn't hyperventilate the danger early enough!!! Burn him at the stake!!!"

    Yep, anything to excuse your exaggerated narrative.

  37. #1037
    Captain Radon Steve's Avatar
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    Some of y’all take this anonymous Internet forum stuff WAY too serious.

  38. #1038

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    Sweater, since your stance seems to only care about the number of COVID deaths. Does that number matter, when the "cure" that has been forced on the population, has taken even more lives?

    Suicide, domestic violence, and drug deaths have surged way beyond normal levels because of COVID procedures. The deaths combined make the deaths from COVID look like small potatoes. But I suppose it's ok that these people are dying because they aren't dying from COVID right?
    Contact me for all your firearms needs. Guns, ammo, accessories, NFA......

  39. #1039
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeepWheelin02 View Post
    Sweater, since your stance seems to only care about the number of COVID deaths. Does that number matter, when the "cure" that has been forced on the population, has taken even more lives?

    Suicide, domestic violence, and drug deaths have surged way beyond normal levels because of COVID procedures. The deaths combined make the deaths from COVID look like small potatoes. But I suppose it's ok that these people are dying because they aren't dying from COVID right?
    American Cancer Society has predicted 30,000 additional deaths from cancer due to denied or delayed treatment. Those people’s lives don’t matter either.

  40. #1040
    The cure has already been worse than the sickness.

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