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Mcstiff
July 1st, 2010, 12:08 AM
http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=73061


(Positive) facts about E85:

1. It is not corrosive to the fuel system or the engine. This is a myth and ethanol is often confused with methanol, which actually have corrosive properties. Some models before 1988 on the other hand may have some parts that is not ethanol resistant. If we are talking Volvo´s, then this mainly applies to the non-electronically injection systems such as K-jet etc. Most cars with electronical fuel injection (EFI) should be resistant to ethanol.

2. It is not as harmful to the nature/environment as gasoline or any other petroleum products for that matter. Ethanol is made out of renewable energy resources such as crops and trees to name a few things. The carbon dioxide that an ethanol powered car emits is not contributing to the greenhouse effect, but is taken up by the plants and is being "re-used". The carbon dioxide then goes around in a closed loop. Gasoline on the other hand is made from oil that comes from old dinosaurs , plants and other stuff 100 000 of years ago, and it doesn´t take part in the closed loop but only adds to the amount of greenhouse gasses. Ethanol is also easily bio-degradeable if it should leak into our environment.

3. E85 is 104-105 octane and therefore it´s more knock-resistent and can tolerate more boost or a higher CR.

4. E85 cools the intake charge more and therefore it´s more knock-resistent and can tolerate more boost or a higher CR. And it also makes the engine run cooler and to some degree, even safer.

5. E85 is in most cases at least 5% more effícient than gasoline at the same lambda value (up to 25% more efficient on some cars optimized soley for E85).

6. Since E85 has very good cleaning properties as well as leaving behind a rest-product of water, it is cleaning the fuel system and it will keep the injectors nice and clean. The combustion chambers, valves, ports and the exhaust will also be clean(er), almost like the car had water injection.

7. In most cases it will cost less $/mile to run on E85.


(Negative) facts about E85:

1. Cars running on E85 have some trouble starting when the engine temperature drops below +5*C. Cars running E100 (not very common) have some trouble starting when the intake (the air) temperature is below +15*C. This is easily solved by using an engine heater in the winter, electrical or fuel-heated (this is recommended on all cars regardless of fuel to get better mileage, less wear on the engine and less impact on the environment etc., but that is another matter to discuss and will not be brought up here...). Some people also adds a little extra gasoline to the tank of E85 to help with cold-starts.

2. Since cars running E85 requires roughly 30% more fuel, a tank of E85 will not get you as far as a tank of gasoline and you will have to refuel more often. This is often disregarded by E85 users who learn to live with it because of the economical gains.
:beer:

_CJ
July 1st, 2010, 08:03 AM
I really this fuel. Spent about a year developing an E85 specific line of engines and learned a great deal about the stuff.

#2 in the negatives is often batted around as fact, but really only applies when converting a pump gas engine to E85.

In the course of development I built two 500HP engines, one designed for premium unleaded gasoline and one for E85. Both ended up using the same volume of fuel in my testing.

:thumbsup:

Steve
July 1st, 2010, 08:19 AM
Some good info, but this part made me laugh:
The carbon dioxide that an ethanol powered car emits is not contributing to the greenhouse effect, but is taken up by the plants and is being "re-used". The carbon dioxide then goes around in a closed loop. Gasoline on the other hand is made from oil that comes from old dinosaurs , plants and other stuff 100 000 of years ago, and it doesn´t take part in the closed loop...

:lmao:

Camp
July 1st, 2010, 08:34 AM
Some good info, but this part made me laugh:

:lmao:

I was thinking the same thing. I'm wondering if the writer wears a GreenPeace shirt and bothers me on the 16th St. mall in his spare time....

Mcstiff
July 1st, 2010, 09:46 AM
The tuning info sounds good; I could care less about the other stuff.

_CJ
July 1st, 2010, 10:05 AM
I found it really interesting that the fuel actually made the intake manifold icy cold to the touch while the rest of the engine was hot. I've got one customer that has reported ice actually forming on the intake at the end of a 1/4 mile run. In a carb'd application this is something of a double edged sword. While the cooler intake charge tends to boost power output, it can cause problems under part throttle street applications.

Mcstiff
July 1st, 2010, 10:10 AM
Luckily I'm running EFI with an 034 Motorsport standalone EMS; just need to get a wideband so I can play without making windows in the block.

The Man With The Plan
July 1st, 2010, 06:26 PM
I am LOVING my e-85 break-in tune on my Subie. I definitely go through a tank quickly though. But given a 104 octane rating, passes smog, and makes increadible power, I'll take the trade off. If you do the math, to get that kind of power with race-gase ($6+/gallon?) e-85 is a bargain at $2.17/gal. AEM stand-alone EMS w/ huge injectors took care of the AFR difference, and now I will run out of turbo before fuel.

I'd like to get a 91-octane tune just so I can run around without worrying about finding e-85, and it would be interesting to see what kind of economy numbers I would get. Currently getting 12-13 mpg with e-85. With a new tune, I think that will get better though.

Mcstiff
July 12th, 2010, 09:54 AM
A few E85 Calculators (http://e85prices.com/milesperdollar.htm)

I'm switching to ~E33 just for S&G until I can get ID1000's installed.