man - woman issue at the workplace

[FORMULA51]

Gender Identity Issue?


I need some help with this. There?s a ?man? who is going thru the steps of changing into a woman that my girlfriend works with. Well, he hasn?t gone thru the woman procedure, but he?s started dressing like a woman, and has also changed his name to a woman name. Well he has started using the womens bathroom. My girlfriend has informed me that she is extremely uncomfortable with him using the womens bathroom while she is in there, and she was using the bathroom while he came in there. Is there some privacy policy or something that can cover this type of thing from happening? Is she overreacting by feeling nervous with using the bathroom while he is in there? IMO, I think this is completely wrong, and something needs to happen at the H.R. level.


Opinions? Da Judge, can ya chime in here a little?


Thanks!!

[JeepWheelin02]

I think until the operation is done it needs its own bathroom, maybe even after the operation.

[scottycards]

I worked with a friggin' trans once.

They have issues. Very serious issues. Tell your chick just to use another restroom, or go when he/she's not around.

Friggin' shemale has more to worry about than which crapper to use.

[Dagimp]

If IT is dressing like a woman I'd say she nothing to worry about. Most likely likes the pole just like her!

Of course I can understand her position. I'd rather be using a urinal next to a gay man than a woman who thought she was a man.

[ZappBranigan]

I worked with a friggin' trans once.

They have issues. Very serious issues. Tell your chick just to use another restroom, or go when he/she's not around.

Friggin' shemale has more to worry about than which crapper to use.

:thumbsup: +1 on this. 2 of my friends from school went the tranny route, both came from seriously messed up homes (alcohol, physical and emotional abuse, etc.)

Not only friends from high school, but believe it or not, my old Battalion Commander from the 3rd Special Forces Group, too!

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/Health/Story?id=1235196&page=1

[FORMULA51]

I think until the operation is done it needs its own bathroom, maybe even after the operation.


that's what i'm saying. the thing is still a man in my mind i don't care if he's in playboy!

[Suki]

eesh, this is becoming more and more common and I can understand both sides. The person in transition just wants to beable to adjust and live the life he/she always believed they should have lived and the other person(s) believe that they shouldn't have to be put in an uncomfortable position because of one persons personal preference or decision.

It's a tough line to be on, for me personally, it wouldn't bother me. Like Dagimp said, the dude/girl has no interest in your gf i'm sure, unless he/she is transitioning to be a lesbian, though not likely. I've know plenty of gay/lesbian/transgender/drag queeens and they just want to be accepted in this homophobic world for who they are and usually don't go out of their way to make someone uncomfortable.

They're still human, they're still people with what they believe to be a genetic disposition that they are trying to correct.

If she's not a total homophob, maybe she should try and get to know this person and try and understand what he's gone through his entire life and how hard it is for people like himself to take that first step to reveal who they really are. OR, if she really just can't bring herself to it, then maybe speak with a HR manager privately with or without the he/she present and try and figure out a nice medium for all parties to feel comfortable.

[Tiffany]

I have a very good friend/co-worker who is transitioning and a family member who has as well. They don't all come from jacked up homes but I doubt any of you would every believe that...

Chad, there is no true legal issue that covers the use of the bathrooms (at least that we had found). At my old job we had single use bathrooms so it was not an issue. I would suggest to her that she speak to someon in HR about the issues she has and ask them to specifiy a certain bathroom for her to use.

[zoriloco]

I think until the operation is done it needs its own bathroom, maybe even after the operation.

X2 if the fawker wants to use the girls room he needs to cut it off. He has to pay some kind of price right? $hit Ill dress up as a girl and go to the ladies rest room to see some panties.

[CLYDE]

Gender Identity Issue?


I need some help with this. There?s a ?man? who is going thru the steps of changing into a woman that my girlfriend works with. Well, he hasn?t gone thru the woman procedure, but he?s started dressing like a woman, and has also changed his name to a woman name. Well he has started using the womens bathroom. My girlfriend has informed me that she is extremely uncomfortable with him using the womens bathroom while she is in there, and she was using the bathroom while he came in there. Is there some privacy policy or something that can cover this type of thing from happening? Is she overreacting by feeling nervous with using the bathroom while he is in there? IMO, I think this is completely wrong, and something needs to happen at the H.R. level.


Opinions? Da Judge, can ya chime in here a little?


Thanks!!

AL24 works with your girlfriend???:shrug:

[newracer]

I'd tell her to inform the HR department of her discomfort and make them figure out what to do.

[FORMULA51]

X2 if the fawker wants to use the girls room he needs to cut it off. He has to pay some kind of price right? $hit Ill dress up as a girl and go to the ladies rest room to see some panties.


exactly what i'm thinking at this point.

so legally i can go into a womans restroom at a ballgame and have no repercussion cause there's no legality to who uses what bathroom?


i'm so confused.

[FORMULA51]

I'd tell her to inform the HR department of her discomfort and make them figure out what to do.


i did that. she's going to talk with them over lunch.

[FORMULA51]

eesh, this is becoming more and more common and I can understand both sides. The person in transition just wants to beable to adjust and live the life he/she always believed they should have lived and the other person(s) believe that they shouldn't have to be put in an uncomfortable position because of one persons personal preference or decision.

It's a tough line to be on, for me personally, it wouldn't bother me. Like Dagimp said, the dude/girl has no interest in your gf i'm sure, unless he/she is transitioning to be a lesbian, though not likely. I've know plenty of gay/lesbian/transgender/drag queeens and they just want to be accepted in this homophobic world for who they are and usually don't go out of their way to make someone uncomfortable.

They're still human, they're still people with what they believe to be a genetic disposition that they are trying to correct.

If she's not a total homophob, maybe she should try and get to know this person and try and understand what he's gone through his entire life and how hard it is for people like himself to take that first step to reveal who they really are. OR, if she really just can't bring herself to it, then maybe speak with a HR manager privately with or without the he/she present and try and figure out a nice medium for all parties to feel comfortable.


she's not a homophob, that's not her problem. she's uncomfortable with using the restroom with mister dangle hanging out, checkin what's up with aunt flow... kind of thing.


i know wimmins use the restroom and things go on in there that men don't need to hear about.


hell, who's to say he doesn't lock the bathroom door and try to get at her or another woman co-worker? although that can happen in any bathroom... :shrug:

[4.0Cherokee]

SEXUAL HARASSMENT =TERMINATION at any work place file complaint with boss :eek:

[Pioneer]

AL24 works with your girlfriend???:shrug:

Smack

[Trango]

Am I the only one who watched south park last night?

[CLYDE]

Am I the only one who watched south park last night?
Quite possibly:flipoff2:

[Steve]

I'd tell her to inform the HR department of her discomfort and make them figure out what to do.

There's nothing HR can do about this.

SEXUAL HARASSMENT =TERMINATION at any work place file complaint with boss :eek:

That's NOT sexual harassment in any way. :rolleyes:


Don't women's stalls have doors? What's he/she gonna see your GF doing anyway? I don't see the problem. :shrug:

[JeepWheelin02]

I don't see the problem.

There is just something wrong about it. :shrug:






































http://www.colorado4x4.org/gallery/files/6/3/8/6/hilurinal.jpg

[jeeplvr79]

one of our values here at work is diversity... if someone were to bring a simaliar situation up like this you would be accused of not living up to the company's values... Welcome to the 21st Century... Unfortunately :(

[Clint]

Am I the only one who watched south park last night?

No you are not :D

Last week was better, WHAT WHAT!

[4.0Cherokee]

[/quote]That's NOT sexual harassment in any way.[quote]
he's a guy she's a girl, he is invading her privacy especialy since its in bathroom. so it is SEXUAL HARASSMENT::D

[Suki]

I don't see it as being sexual harassment, but here's a definition for shats and giggles

Sexual Harassment:
Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature constitutes sexual harassment when submission to or rejection of this conduct explicitly or implicitly affects an individual's employment, unreasonably interferes with an individual's work performance or creates an intimidating, hostile or offensive work environment.

-- http://www.eeoc.gov/facts/fs-sex.html

[the007forum]

No you are not :D

Last week was better, WHAT WHAT!

i didnt even understand last night. cartman as a teacher?

but i understand everyone has right to be them selves, however they should not be allowed to do things that go against other people rights. its really tough. hopefully management just finds a quiet way to make everyone happy like a different bathroom for you GF.

im going to go into work practicing my nudist beliefs and let you guys know how that goes ;)

[newracer]

There's nothing HR can do about this.
BS, just because a male (he still has the parts so he is technically a male) dresses like a woman and takes a female name doesn't give him the right to use the womens restroom and make co-workers uncomfortable. Definitely an HR issue.

[Steve]

BS, just because a male (he still has the parts so he is technically a male) dresses like a woman and takes a female name doesn't give him the right to use the womens restroom and make co-workers uncomfortable. Definitely an HR issue.


I've seen the exact same circumstance with a past employer. HR couldn't legally do anything about it. Believe whatever you want. :shrug:

There is no legal right to never be uncomfortable.

[newracer]

Maybe there is nothing legally they can do but they can get involved to try to solve the problem.

[Dotcom]

sounds like an offensive, hostile or intimidating work environment to me. glad i work from home so i don't have to deal with issues like this, I only get harassed by my dogs when im working.

[GFX]

i didnt even understand last night. cartman as a teacher?


Watch the movie stand and deliver. I was dying last night when carmenez showed up.

[Batgirl]

...

There is no legal right to never be uncomfortable.

There it is.

I still think that they might be willing to work something out, 'they' meaning including the person who is going through the transition. I know of a workplace that had one male and one female bathroom and a similar situation. Because a few of the other employees that were initially weirded out (THEY got over it), they had a sign on the door that they could use if they wanted privacy. That was hardly used, but for those that wanted it, it was there. Problem solved.

But really, do you guys really think this person is going through all of this just to be in the same bathroom with women? Seriously? :rolleyes:

[JKTODD]

She could offer "her" a tampon next time they are in the bathroom together. Oh wait that probably would be harrasment.

[Suki]

But really, do you guys really think this person is going through all of this just to be in the same bathroom with women? Seriously? :rolleyes:


I guess sneaking into the dressing rooms just isn't cutting it anymore. they'd rather chop and stuff their manhood just to get a peak on the underpanties. /sarcasm

[zoriloco]

Cut his freakin balls off!!!! oh wait thats what he wants to do. Sheat!!! :confused: :shrug:

[potter]

They should just make all the bathrooms unisex. It's not weird at all, there's nothing wrong with men or women being in the same bathroom. No matter what their sexual preference or naughty bits look like.

Anyone ever been in a unisex bathroom? Sure, it's weird at first but you get used to it just like anything else. It's all about breaking down the fake barriers we've created for society. Those invisible lines that have been built into our head of what is right and wrong.

[Batgirl]

sounds like an offensive, hostile or intimidating work environment to me. glad i work from home so i don't have to deal with issues like this, I only get harassed by my dogs when im working.

This isn't directed to you Dotcom, but your post just makes me laugh when I think of how many comments, notes, bad jokes, even pawing I've dealt with over the years. I can handle myself and with one exception, I straightened the guys out myself.

So to hear people get so upset over a transgender person just using a bathroom- one that has individual stalls- just makes me shake my head. Women deal with sexist crap all the time; it's often how much energy you put into it and how personal you take things that makes it a problem. Yes, I KNOW there are exceptions as I noted before, been there, done that.

I'd choose a transgender person in my bathroom over 90% of the above mentioned experiences anyday.

Anyway, Formula, suggest your GF to try the sign idea. :D

[scottycards]

I can't hold out any longer.

From the movie Clerks:

Dante Hicks: Hey, whatcha rent?
[reads the cover to Randal's videotape]

Dante Hicks: "Best of Both Worlds"?

Randal Graves: Hermaphroditic porn. Starlets with both organs. You should see the box. Beautiful chicks with dicks that put mine to shame.

Dante Hicks: And you rented this?

Randal Graves: Hey, I like to expand my horizons.

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

[ZappBranigan]

Anyone ever been in a unisex bathroom? Sure, it's weird at first but you get used to it just like anything else. It's all about breaking down the fake barriers we've created for society. Those invisible lines that have been built into our head of what is right and wrong.

We had a unisex latrine when I was in Korea. Basically they just closed off the stand-up urinals (it had been an all-male barracks before) and everyone used the stalls. The shower had designated times for men and women (sorry, it wasn't anything like the coed shower scene in Starship Troopers.:rolleyes: )

It really wasn't that big a deal, at least for the guys. I don't know if the women felt uncomfortable with it or not but women in the military have to get used to things like that, so I don't think it really bothered them.

[Dotcom]

This isn't directed to you Dotcom, but your post just makes me laugh when I think of how many comments, notes, bad jokes, even pawing I've dealt with over the years. I can handle myself and with one exception, I straightened the guys out myself.

So to hear people get so upset over a transgender person just using a bathroom- one that has individual stalls- just makes me shake my head. Women deal with sexist crap all the time; it's often how much energy you put into it and how personal you take things that makes it a problem. Yes, I KNOW there are exceptions as I noted before, been there, done that.

I'd choose a transgender person in my bathroom over 90% of the above mentioned experiences anyday.

Anyway, Formula, suggest your GF to try the sign idea. :D

i understand so no worries, however, what one person finds offensive or hostile or intimidating can be different from others. that being said, if she finds the situation intimidating, hostile, or offensive then her company is required to act.

i can't say if the person who is switching genders has the right to use the ladies room or not as i am not an attorney all i know is that if i was in the mens room and a person came in that i knew was a woman but they were dressed as a man i would have a problem with it. is it right or wrong? who knows i just know how i would feel so i can understand why she would feel uncomfortable.

[JKTODD]

I used to go to a nightclub while living in San Diego that had unisex bathrooms sort of. They were posted male and female. No one really cared. It was acutally kind of cool. But then every now and then people had sex in them. :D:thumbsup:

[scottycards]

Unisex restroom sounds like the only good application for the Larry Craig "wide stance" maneuver.

[Barf Bag]

I'd rather be using a urinal next to a gay man than a woman who thought she was a man.

No doubt, a gay man can still aim, you would be less likely to get urine on your shoes

[1973CJ5]

Unisex are fine until you have to follow the smokin' hot chick who just dropped a bomb! I expect the guy's bathroom to smell bad...

[ZappBranigan]

It was acutally kind of cool. But then every now and then people had sex in them. :D:thumbsup:

What, and that wasn't cool? ;)

[Metalhed]

I work for the Federal Govt and at one building I worked at this same thing happened. Management had to get a seperate bathroom for IT. The women folks were up in arms about a he/she using or sharing any bathroom with them.

[Batgirl]

I used to go to a nightclub while living in San Diego that had unisex bathrooms sort of. They were posted male and female. No one really cared. It was acutally kind of cool. But then every now and then people had sex in them. :D:thumbsup:
Maybe I just had bad taste in friends and clubs, but back in the day when I frequented them, I can certainly remember that MALE OR FEMALE on the door meant a whole lot of nothing. :D

Girls room always had a wait, and sometimes that meant I wasn't waiting. I guess we were lucky that we didn't get sued by terrorized patrons. :flipoff2: Sometimes the guys would walk into the girls bathrooms too.

And I saw (well heard or deduced, mostly) sex and other illicit going-ons in those stalls on occasion too. Somehow I escaped having psychotherapy for the trauma :rolleyes:

[Suki]

Nothing has changed, it's still the same at those clubs/bars.

The guys were ALWAYS in the girls bathrooms, doing their makeup, hair, chit chatting, hell half the time there either weren't doors on all of the stalls or they wouldn't lock, so they'd either hold the door shut or wouldn't even pay any mind to girl squatting on the toilet taking a tinkle. Back in my younger 21 clubbin days, me and girlfriends would get sick of waiting in line and just go in the mens bathroom and use the stall. no big deal.

[Batgirl]

I guess the Ally McBeal crew was way ahead of their time. :D

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z168/thewordisberry/toilet.jpg

[Jefe]

Starbucks at the Flatirons. There is one tranny, and one wanna be. eeeewwwwwwwww.........

[Barf Bag]

Back in my younger 21 clubbin days, me and girlfriends would get sick of waiting in line and just go in the mens bathroom and use the stall.

Dang, even I would steer clear of the men's room stalls in a club, especially on a college night. Although the mens room at Washingtons in Ft Collins on college night was usually good for some entertainment, seeing that unfortunate ass that drank too much and is now passed out in 1/8 inch of standing urine on the floor, his frat brothers trying to get him to stand up so they dont all get kicked out, funny stuff.

[1973CJ5]

Dang, even I would steer clear of the men's room stalls in a club, especially on a college night. Although the mens room at Washingtons in Ft Collins on college night was usually good for some entertainment, seeing that unfortunate ass that drank too much and is now passed out in 1/8 inch of standing urine on the floor, his frat brothers trying to get him to stand up so they dont all get kicked out, funny stuff.

Glad to hear that Wash hasn't changed in the 15 years I have been gone!!!

[Oscar]

Bathrooms in Korea would have a mens room door and Womens room door but they led into the same bathromm pretty funny when you drunk and you went to use the mens room for the first time.

[Suki]

Dang, even I would steer clear of the men's room stalls in a club, especially on a college night. Although the mens room at Washingtons in Ft Collins on college night was usually good for some entertainment, seeing that unfortunate ass that drank too much and is now passed out in 1/8 inch of standing urine on the floor, his frat brothers trying to get him to stand up so they dont all get kicked out, funny stuff.

lol, you know the girls bathrooms at bars/clubs really aren't that much nicer.. or even cleaner than the boys.

[Aaron]

Glad to hear that Wash hasn't changed in the 15 years I have been gone!!!

x2

[LONEWOLF]

Sporting events and concerts women use the mens room all the time because the line is to long at the womens. No one seems to mind then.

[oleblue]

Nothing HR can do. Funny. I had to answer to HR because someone I said "how are you doing" took it offensively. So I was not allowed to speak to this person whom then reported that I was being offensive by not talking to them. I was singling them out. Yet a man can go into the womens room and nothing they can do... there has to be some kind of BS in that. There sure was a bunch of BS in my cases.

[Wild Hare]

technically speaking, since when is it unlawful for a women to use a mens room or a man to use a womens room? just because they are labled that way per a building code does not make it a law. obviously the trans is not interested in women, so whats the difference between a trans using the ladies room or a lesbian. is your lady uncomfortable around lesbians?the only time she will be next to he/she is while washing hands there are privacy panels and stalls in the restrooms correct? unless the trans actually threatens, suggests or directly interacts with your lady HR can't do anything about it. they are obviously supporting his/her situation by allowing the cross dressing etc.so welcome to the new world.

[ni0h]

I would suggest to her that she speak to someon in HR about the issues she has and ask them to specifiy a certain bathroom for her to use.

That way lies termination. Anyone who fails to "celebrate" all perversions is subject to "diversity" indoctrination.

[Steve]

that being said, if she finds the situation intimidating, hostile, or offensive then her company is required to act.

Nope, that's not even remotely true. Just because someone is offended by something does NOT mean an employer has to make an accomodation, especially when such accomodation may well subject said company to a lawsuit.

I'll say it again, you have NO legal right whatsoever to never be offended or uncomfortable, and your employer has NO legal right to act just because one employee may be offended or uncomfortable.

[Tiffany]

That way lies termination. Anyone who fails to "celebrate" all perversions is subject to "diversity" indoctrination.

Funny. I never have had an issue with diversity...in the workplace or anywhere else.

[Dotcom]

Nope, that's not even remotely true. Just because someone is offended by something does NOT mean an employer has to make an accomodation, especially when such accomodation may well subject said company to a lawsuit.

I'll say it again, you have NO legal right whatsoever to never be offended or uncomfortable, and your employer has NO legal right to act just because one employee may be offended or uncomfortable.

i didn't say make an accommodation but they do have to look into the matter, in other words they can not ignore it.

[Steve]

i didn't say make an accommodation but they do have to look into the matter, in other words they can not ignore it.

True enough. They could ignore it but that's not in their best interest. In this case they should "look into it" and tell the GF that there's nothing they can or should do.

[SUPERGILDO43]

I used to go to a nightclub while living in San Diego that had unisex bathrooms sort of. They were posted male and female. No one really cared. It was acutally kind of cool. But then every now and then people had sex in them. :D:thumbsup:

HAHA GET IT, uniSEX

ok, im lame. anyways, what an akward situation. I would easily assume there is no established protocol and you should just tell your girlfriend to wing it on how she feel she should handle it and react appropriately.

[FORMULA51]

IMO, why should all the other girls have to use a different bathroom cause this "guy" wants to use the women's restroom? If he wants to use the womens restroom, then he should be the one with a designated restroom.


Update: She's not the only girlie that works there that has problems with this. Even a female that is good friends with this guy/girl is having problems with this.


I mean come on. The guy just got divorced and has 2 kids, not to mention their pictures hanging on his cube.

That leads me to... HELL YA SHE'S UNCOMFORTABLE!!!!

If this guy never really had any "background" if you will, with other females, let alone CHILDREN, then yes this may be a moot issue.


When you go from having huge spikes thru your lips, shaved head, doc martins all white laced up to the knees with more chains than a typical biker does, to wearing a wig and high heels the NEXT FRICKEN DAY, there is a problem.


There is no inclination that this guy only is attracted to men or whatever. Had this guy not had pictures hanging up of his CHILDREN, this would definitely go over differently.

[zoriloco]

IMHO I say why even accomodate to his/her needs anyway? Its like when you go to an interview. if you show up with tatoos, piercings and what not, then the company cant later on come in and say you cant use them. So if you show up to an interview with a D!ck, and then want to lose it, why even accomadate to his " I need to use a girls bathroom now need". Get him a porta potty hahahaha :D

But thats just me.

[cheftyler]

SEXUAL HARASSMENT =TERMINATION at any work place file complaint with boss :eek:

I do love it when people say this...and it's always the ones who have ZERO experience with the matter. Almost every HR department in this litigious country says that, but it's a load of crap. My wife was involved in a sexual harassment case when she worked for Whole Foods. She took it to her boss, the boss freaked out assured my wife that said douche would be terminated as he tried to force her to kiss him at the end of her shift one day. Well it goes up the ladder to HR, Regional HR, and Corporate HR and guess what they said...There is no one to corroborate my wifes version of the story, and of course the guy said he did nothing of the sort so tough, deal with it. They were supposed to be on opposite shifts from that day forward until she could transfer to another store...but apparently the guy who did the scheduling thought that was too tough to work around so after a week he started scheduling them together for EVERY shift.
Similar thing happened at the company I'm working at, except our HR person didn't say that the guy would be fired, and a new company policy that those two were not to be alone together was formed. He admitted to part of it, and he still didn't get fired.

Thank you lawyers for making our world wonderful.

[Wild Hare]

sexual harassment does not mean termination. it all depends on the company's sexual harassment policy or if one even exists.usually the first offense is a verbal warning to stop. second offense is a written reprimand, third would be another written reprimand and then termination would follow. i have seen many instances where a male and female were chummy and all was good until the female got pissed and claimed sexual harassment.

[Pilot]

Sporting events and concerts women use the mens room all the time because the line is to long at the womens. No one seems to mind then.


This happened to me at Red Rocks at the Sheryl Crow concert a while back. A bunch of women came in to the Men's room, and I mean a bunch when I was standing at the urinal. Hey, if they want to get flashed I don't care.