School me on 85-95 4x4 Diesels.

[lostinwoods]

Not sure if this is that right sub forum but here it goes.

I was hoping some of you diesel guys could over some opinions/comments/answers on older diesels, like between ?85 to 95?.:hail:
I am thinking of getting another truck and don?t have a great deal of money (no more then 5K) since I just had a baby on Dec 26th. I have a 91 F150 reg-cab (it runs great, never any problems) but now I was thinking of getting an extra cab with the addition to the family. I was thinking of a diesel if they might be worth it. I do not tow or haul anything, just like to have a truck when I need it; but I thought that having a diesel would be nice to tow my Jeep if I decided to go off-roading further then a 2 day trip one way..

Questions:
In those years are then even worth it?
I am asking for mechanical problems or are they reliable even with 200K miles?
During those years, does one brand stand out more then the others?
Back in the day, I use to hear you can get 300K miles out of a diesel, how true is that?
I was hoping I could get around the same mileage I get now 16-19 mpg, is that possible?
Could these older trucks flat tow a 4000+ YJ or trailer an YJ without many issues?
Should I look for a certain engine choice, if possible?
All I have seen so far is mid 80s Ford and some early 90s Dodge Diesels around that price range; any comments on those?
Any comments would be great!


Thanks

[CSP]

Questions:
In those years are then even worth it?

Depends on if you're ok with going slow or not (pre-94 Ford and any GM anyhow)


I am asking for mechanical problems or are they reliable even with 200K miles?

With the proper maintenance they should be fine. "Proper" depends on brand as each has things to watch out for.

During those years, does one brand stand out more then the others?

Not really, but the Cummins is the most powerful within that time frame.

Back in the day, I use to hear you can get 300K miles out of a diesel, how true is that?

Depends on proper maintenance again.
I was hoping I could get around the same mileage I get now 16-19 mpg, is that possible?

Absolutely for an unladen truck.
Could these older trucks flat tow a 4000+ YJ or trailer an YJ without many issues?

Depends on the tow setup and what you consider "issues".

Should I look for a certain engine choice, if possible?

That's a personal preference thing. It's gotta go with creature comforts and other variables too.

All I have seen so far is mid 80s Ford and some early 90s Dodge Diesels around that price range; any comments on those?

Both can be good choices depending on your needs, but research both to see if either works as a choice for you. Drive a couple of each if you can.


There is a tow rig forum BTW.

[lostinwoods]

Thanks for the comments CSP.
I know I am being vague with the questions but I know nothing about diesels and I am just looking for some opinions. I completely understand that there is no right answer, everyone has their own opinions, and there are never any guarantees when you buy something.
You know if everyone/a-lot of people started to say ?OMG don't buy late 80s ford with such and such motor or 90-92 Dodge with Cummins are the bomb that could lead me in some what of a direction.
Really, what I do know is that I would like is...

Under 5000, around 4000 would be great.
4x4 ext cab short or long bed
Something that might avg around 18-19 mpg with no load.
I am not worried about speed, but as long as it could hold it's on towing 6-7000lbs through the passes if I needed it to; like I said I drive my rig to the trails but it would be nice to maybe tow it on long trips.
Maybe something that has somewhat of a history of reliability.
Ultimately, I make may own choices but thought I would ask some of you guys what you thought.

[1967k10]

Let me help ya here. Don't buy a Ford pre-95 or a Chevy pre-01. I have an 01 Chevy D-Max and it will pull almost anything at whatever speed but it isn't stock :hail: :D .

In your price range you'd be looking at a 89-93 {1st gen} Cummins. They get good MPG's and you can crank 350-400HP out of them :D . With a few mods you can make 200-250 which would easily tow your Jeep at speed. I'd get a 91.5-93 because they are intercooled and can handle more power while staying cool. If you get a 5spd look for one that has been upgraded to the 94+ tranny cause the early ones were prone to failure if they towed heavy. Auto wise don't get a 3spd and if you do mod it be prepared to beef up the tranny. Same with a 5spd you will need to put a different clutch in if you get real excited :D .
Hope that helps ya a bit.

[osue077]

As said above, if you could find an 89-93 Dodge, that is what I would go with. Otherwise, I would try to find a 95-97 Ford with the 5 speed. Not the regular f250 tho, F250 HD or F350. Also if it were me, I would stay away from any of the automatics. None of them last as long as the manuals, IMO.

[mdurbahn]

try to get a 93 dodge, they have a better tranny and intercooler if I remember correctly. i wouldnt even look at a older ford or gm.

[lostinwoods]

Thanks guys,
I thought that the early Ford and Chevy (80s) would not be that good. I like the early 90s dodges for several reasons; cummins, intercooler, turbo and the looks, I just wanted to see if i might be somewhat close in my ideas.

Thanks again

[nord]

I like the 7.3 strokes and the duramaxes too, but considering the years you mention and the budget, another vote for the Dodge. 91.5-93 with the cummins/5spd are pretty good. D60 fronts, D70 LSD Rears, np205 or np241 xfer cases. 3.54 gears and the 5spd will get you 18mpg and better in a 4wd. The Bosch VE injection pump those years is not as good as the 1994-1996 pump, but the tricks to turn it up and its weaknesses are well-documented online. Hint, unless you want to go more than 645tq/250hp, don't turn up the pressures on this one, use injector upgrades to flow more fuel (< $500 for all 6). Adjust the flow and smoke, just not the pressure - yep, I blew one up! It will tow all day long and run quarter miles in the 16's at this level.

Look hard enough, you will find a 92 or 93 where someone has put a NV4500 with 5th gear fixed in place of the Getrag. Don't let the getrag 5spd turn you off, some folks have great luck with them (I have 180K on one), others not so great. The good news is standard transmission and other rebuilders have dropped the price of the parts for them so they are rebuildable.

Have fun truck shopping,
jon

[fredlg]

For similar reasons and similar budget, I ended up purchasing a Gen 1 (89-93) Dodge Cummins. If you're considering it, I'd recommend spending a few hours reading here, especially the 1st "sticky". Lots of good info and support there.

http://www.dieseltruckresource.com/dev/forumdisplay.php?f=93

It is noisy, rough riding, and has boxy styling (which I happen to like).

It is also reasonably economical, pulls my Jeep easily, is easy to turn up the power some with only hand tools without spending a dime, is easy to work on, reliable, and will likely run just about forever.

I acknowledge that its rather crude compared to new trucks, but so is my CJ compared to the newer Jeeps. I kind of like it that way, but neither are my daily drivers.

[lostinwoods]

Thanks fredlg, i looked over the site and found it very useful. I will do more reading before i buy.
Thanks to all who gave opinions.

[CLYDE]

The 6.9 and early 7.3 are total crap, until they came out with the powersmoke, they were garbage. Owned several in tow trucks I had, pure hell, and even worse stay away from the ZF trannys, and the 2 piece shaker flywheels that tend to blow apart when your 800 miles from home.

[COcummins]

yet another vote for early '90's dodge cummins. that motor is very simple and easy to work on. as with any brand (ford, chevy, dodge) the truck will have it's quirks and draw backs but that motor is a reliable, strong work horse, and it gets good milage. my truck is still getting around 15mpg with a horrible gearing/tire ratio.
also check out www.dieselram.com if you're wanting more info on 1st and 2nd generation ram diesels

[broncocrawler]

The 6.9 and early 7.3 are total crap, until they came out with the powersmoke, they were garbage. Owned several in tow trucks I had, pure hell, and even worse stay away from the ZF trannys, and the 2 piece shaker flywheels that tend to blow apart when your 800 miles from home.

OK I have to call BS here. I have several of these trucks right now and think they are great trucks.The flywheel is a problem but for $400 you can replace the flywheel and clutch with a normal one. The trucks are not the most powerfull but they are torque motors and will pull what ever you want. I pulled a 12k fifth wheel to baja and back last year with no problems. Stock there are non turbo except some 93 and 94 trucks, but you can pick up a turbo kit for around $700 on ebay. My truck is turbo and intercooled with the pump turned up and will out run a stock PSD. Any other questions just ask cause I know all there is to know about the IDI Ford'. You can also check out oilburners.net for more info. DAvid

[firegod33]

Both the first gen cummins and the old IDI diesels are good motors. I picked up an '86 F350 Crew cab 4x4 for $2100 with the 6.9. It has 311,000 miles and still runs strong. My Powerstroke will outrun it but it pulls plenty strong and gets 18 mpg with out overdrive.

[bigdog87]

I agree with broncocrawler. I got a 94 F350 IDI with factory turbo (no intercooler). 213,0000+ on the odd. Empty it will out run most anything. With a heavy YJ on a 20' flatbed it will cruise at 75+ MPH except for some of the steeper passes. I picked up my 4 door long bed a few years ago for 3000. The Ford IDI is nice cause it is really a Navstar/ International engine, so engine parts can be bought through International truck(much cheaper that dealerships). The dodges arn't bad either, but stay away from the GM's

[lostinwoods]

Thanks for all the replies guys!
I am doing alot of reading and searching the classifies.
I have found a couple i like but i may have to wait a little while for my truck.
I just had a baby girl on Dec 26th and wanted to get something a little bigger then my 91 std cab f150 but it looks like the wifes 91 suby wagon is not looking like it will be around much longer (starting to give us problems and a tad to small) so i think i might have to change my efforts to a mini van for now.

I wonder if someone would trade me my f150 4x4 4.9 6 cyl 71,000 miles for a 1st gen dodge?

Thanks again guys

[commandoNate]

I have a 92 CTD ext cab and I love it. It is over 280,000 and still running strong. I tow my jeep, haul a camper, tow bobcat and heavy materials trailers at work almost daily. The backseat is not too roomy for my kids, but I put a bench in the middle for a carseat so my son can sit there in the back between the two bucket seats, and the little girl rides shotgun.

All early cummins' are turbo, I believe that all 92-93's have intercooler. The auto's in these early CTD's are typically the TF727 which is much better than the later 47RE auto's that came in the 2nd gen. dodges (94 and up).

The 93's come with the NV 4500 5 speed which is far superior to the GETRAG 5 speeds that are in the 92 and down trucks.

Good luck, hope you don't get roped into the minivan world.

NK