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Gags
September 14th, 2007, 11:06 AM
Teen Bride: Salvation Tied to Marriage
By JENNIFER DOBNER, Associated Press Writer
4 hours ago

ST. GEORGE, Utah - A former follower of a polygamous sect leader claims she was acting to preserve her eternal salvation when she obeyed his command and married her cousin at age 14.

Now 21, the woman was married in a 2001 religious ceremony to her 19-year-old cousin, then followed the counsel of Warren Jeffs to submit to her husband "mind, body and soul."

Jeffs, 51, leader of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, went on trial Thursday on two counts of rape as an accomplice for using his church authority to coerce the marriage.

The bride was the first witness in the trial and was expected to return to the stand Friday.

On Thursday, she testified that Jeffs has long been an authority figure in her life. In 2001, he was a high-ranking church counselor and had been the girl's teacher and principal at an FLDS-run school, teaching children principles of the faith.

In 2002, Jeffs became church president, or "prophet," succeeding his father.

"The prophet was as God to us. He was God on Earth and his counselors were pretty much the same, so they had jurisdiction over us," she said.

The Associated Press generally does not name people alleging sexual abuse.

Prosecutors played a tape of a marriage lesson recorded by Jeffs in 1997 to emphasize the point that obedience by women of the faith was expected.

"Give yourself to him, that means full obedience to righteous principles. No half way, no holding back," Jeffs said on the tape.

The girl first had sex with her cousin about two months after a ceremony in a Nevada motel, according to previous testimony in the case.

The defense is looking to Jeffs' own words to illustrate for jurors that forced sex is not condoned in FLDS culture.

During a 1999 sermon, defense attorney Tara Isaacson said, Jeffs told followers that a "man should only have marital relations with a wife if she invites it."

The girl may not have liked being married to her cousin, but "being unhappy is different from being raped," Isaacson said.

Jeffs, 51, was a fugitive for nearly two years and was on the FBI's Most Wanted list when he was arrested during a traffic stop outside Las Vegas in August 2006. If convicted, he could spend the rest of his life in prison.

Jeffs has led the FLDS church since 2002. Followers see him as a prophet who communicates with God and holds dominion over their salvation; ex-church members say he reigns with an iron fist, demanding perfect obedience from followers.

He is not charged with being a polygamist, and the marriage between the cousins was monogamous. Still, polygamy casts a long shadow over the case.

Polygamy advocates have long contended that the freedom to practice plural marriage as part of their religion is a civil rights matter. Members of FLDS, which broke away from the Mormon church, believe polygamy brings exaltation in heaven.

The practice is banned in the Utah Constitution, though, and it is considered a felony offense. The Mormon church disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members found to still be practicing plural marriage.

The trial is expected to last through next week.

CherryokeeXJ
September 14th, 2007, 11:15 AM
Fawked up.

SSII
September 14th, 2007, 11:54 AM
The practice is banned in the Utah Constitution, still practiced though, and it is considered a felony offense if you slip up and it makes it into the public eye. The Mormon church disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members found to still be practicing plural marriage openly.

Fixed it! :)

What they fail to mention is the polygamist hideout of the Salt Lake City Mormons that return to Pinesdale Montana once a month every year. Oh, Did I let that one slip?

Gags
September 14th, 2007, 11:56 AM
The practice is banned in the Utah Constitution, still practiced though, and it is considered a felony offense if you slip up and it makes it into the public eye. The Mormon church disavowed polygamy in 1890 and excommunicates members found to still be practicing plural marriage openly.

Fixed it! :)

What they fail to mention is the polygamist hideout of the Salt Lake City Mormons that return to Pinesdale Montana once a month every year. Oh, Did I let that one slip?

Yeah I know...

scottycards
September 14th, 2007, 12:02 PM
Snide comments being withheld due to concern for lack of sense of humor from others on the board.............

So much to say here.

Gags
September 14th, 2007, 12:07 PM
Snide comments being withheld due to concern for lack of sense of humor from others on the board.............

So much to say here.

I know!

Gags
September 14th, 2007, 12:14 PM
It's like a religion of child molesters.

scottycards
September 14th, 2007, 12:19 PM
You just can't resist, can ya? Posting, that is..........

The Revised Colorado Statues were posted in another thread- I happened to see Escort Licensing Provisions while browsing. If the wine biz doesn't work out, I'm now versed in what it takes to become a licensed Escort Service operator- just hit me up for the info........

Jake_Blues
September 14th, 2007, 12:26 PM
a licensed Escort Service operator- just hit me up

Straight up PIMPIN!

-E

Yota
September 14th, 2007, 12:32 PM
You know even though most of us would look on this from outside and think it has little to do with us directly, it is very informative and applicable in one sense.

If you focused on how these cult leaders almost always operate, you would notice they thrive on having an almost complete monopoly on what information their followers are allowed to get from outside the leader's sphere of influence. Some might call it brainwashing, and I guess it results in that, but it's really just complete indoctrination to one point of view with no option for others - at least not until the primary indoctrination has produced the desired effects.

That indoctrination is at least parallel to, if not the same as, how totalitarian political leaders force their people into a mindless - no, it's not mindless at all is it? - role of nearly-unquestioning obedience. The more the leader(s) can limit outside information and influence, the more control he has over those under his influence. I see parallels in some of the ridiculous (by my standards) behavior I've seen in videos from North Korea of people nearly worshipping the Kims. That's one of the worst cases and it varies in severity depending on where you go and how much the leader(s) has clamped down on outside and inside information. I think certainly the US would have to rank high in allowing all kinds of information and would be on the opposite pole from N. Korea. But you can look at places like China that heavily censor outside and inside information or at Iran which does the same or more, or at countries like Venezuela with an emerging dictator, Chavez, who is beginning to eliminate private TV stations that have been critical of him and is putting them under his control.

It is a scale of information control that grades from N. Korea on one end to something like the United States on the other end (there may even be countries more liberal than the US in regards to free speech and there may be some worse than N. Korea in regards to controlled indoctrination).

If you can shape the information a person gets for long enough (and I think the length part is critical) you can make that person - or people - do almost anything.

Steve
September 14th, 2007, 12:41 PM
Snide comments being withheld due to concern for lack of sense of humor from others on the board.............

Since when? :flipoff2:

sweater
September 14th, 2007, 12:55 PM
If you can shape the information a person gets for long enough (and I think the length part is critical) you can make that person - or people - do almost anything.

I know!

"The surge is working"

"The surge is working"

"The surge is working"

"The surge is working"
.
.
.
.

:flipoff2:

- mike

PS - soooooooooo couldn't resist.

PPS - at least one of my cousins back east is stupid hawt. Boulder City marriage ceremony, here I come!!!

Malamute
September 14th, 2007, 01:01 PM
It's like a religion of child molesters.

Mormons or these fundamentalist weirdos?

I really don't think what they are doing down in Colorado City is recognized as a religion.

Backwoods Rambler
September 14th, 2007, 01:03 PM
You know even though most of us would look on this from outside and think it has little to do with us directly, it is very informative and applicable in one sense..............................................

................If you can shape the information a person gets for long enough (and I think the length part is critical) you can make that person - or people - do almost anything.

I find a lot of things you say facinating! Conversations with you must be fantastic! Great analysis beyond the surface conversation.:thumbsup: And I totally agree.

Gags
September 14th, 2007, 01:22 PM
I find a lot of things you say facinating! Conversations with you must be fantastic! Great analysis beyond the surface conversation.:thumbsup: And I totally agree.

Conversations with Yota are great.

Oscar
September 14th, 2007, 01:40 PM
How did we get from Utah to North Korea ?

Steve
September 14th, 2007, 01:42 PM
How did we get from Utah to North Korea ?

Either boat or airplane, silly. :P