Grizzly lake road closures

[rockkrusher]

After going up to Grizzly lake over the weekend I saw where they had closed off the roads to all the camp sites.Some I agree with and some I don't. I am pretty sure that the land on the right side of the lake is private and they should not have been able to close that.
After talking to 2 people at the FS who said that there were no closures up there one got on the line and told me that it was closed due resource damage.
They created another problem in that they realy left no where to park with out blocking the road or anther rig or on a grassy area.The FS told me that they sent 2 groups up there to do repairs but would not say who.
In talking to some of the locals I was told that the Quiet Coalition and the FS went up there to do repairs but the FS kept it quiet about the closures.It is not any where on the FS website and most know very little about it.It is said that they did the same thing up around Hancock lake also and have plans for doing so in other areas also.In the 25 years that I have been going up there I have never seen anyone off trail or cause damage to the land except once when an atv was out tearing up the wet lands and I stopped him from doing any more damage.And once when some baby Jeeps winched some logs out of the way that were blocking the left side of the lake.They too were stopped.That was about 6 years ago.It is said that the Quiet Coalition is out to make it so we wont want to go up there and they are doing it quietly.Everyone is always looking out for the greenies but seems this group gets overlooked due to their way of manipulating the system.There have been many other things that they have pulled that I wont go into here.I dont belong to any clubs or groups I am just a wheeler and someone needs to adopt this trail before we lose the right to go up there.I will gladly go and help any off road club or group that adopts it to do repairs or what ever.
Fred G.

[mrladewig]

I'm surprised by that action too. I've been up there a few times over the last couple years and did not think that the trail seemed abused, especially in comparison to MANY other trails in the region.

It doesn't seem like we are getting a straight answer on this.

Mel-

[rockkrusher]

The Quiet Coalition has been involved in many actions that no one realy gets a straight answer on.No meetings no votes no other input just BAM.They have talked to land owners and tried to get them to close down their access as well not just the FS

[shotgunchris]

Here's their website: http://quietuse.org/GigPage.aspx?PageID=100

[MonkeyBomb]

From their website

*Saturday, August 25, 2007 ~8:30-~4 p.m.
QUC Volunteer Work Day near Billings Lake Area North Fork Basin west of Salida. Join us to help protect this spectacular area and keep our waters and water supply clean.
The site is accessed via the North Fork road off Hwy 50 at Maysville, and high clearence vehicles can drive to the work site. There are numerous ways for all abilities and skill levels to assist with this project.

[ZooMad75]

We were up in the st. elmo area a couple of weeks ago. We ran into an atv'er up at hancock lake and got to talking about the issue. The Quiet group came up. Seems as what this guy told me, is that there is a Ranger that comes out of either St. Elmo or Alpine who is posting road closed signs on known open 4wd/atv trails. He called him Ranger Bob and that he was a member of the quiet coalition.

Now I totally realize it's just the statement from one guy we met when camping, but he's up there every couple of weekends on his atv. He knows a lot of locals and from how he said it, the locals all know of "ranger bob" and his antics to shut trails down based on his own agenda. This guy mentioned that the atv rental place out of St. Elmo has had multiple run-in's with ranger bob about trail use. Mind you it was sane, tread lightly trail use, but the issues were about the actual trail's status as open or closed.

How this makes things worse is the locals that know the trails that ranger bob has closed (on his own illegally), so they bypass the closure signs and keep using the trail. This activity regardless of how the locals feel they are justified the trail is open, makes us all look like we don't heed the signs posted. All it takes is one of the quiet guys waiting in the bushes to take photo proof of it or any other greenie and we look as if we are off marked trails.

I don't know of how much validity this guy we met's story is, but I didn't think about it until this post came up about the quiet coalition. Might be worth calling up the ATV rental place up there to see if there's any truth to the story about ranger bob and his personal agenda.

[rockkrusher]

I dont need to call the atv place I have known them for years! What you were told is pretty much the same story who ever tells it. Bob has put up several illiegal signs including no camping and no fires in places it is fully allowed. Thats why I said some one needs to adopt the trail.Hell you are from P-town also.There are several haere that run up there we just arent a club or actual group so we cant do it right now but might be able to come up with something if no one else does or wants to.

[rockkrusher]

From their website

*Saturday, August 25, 2007 ~8:30-~4 p.m.
QUC Volunteer Work Day near Billings Lake Area North Fork Basin west of Salida. Join us to help protect this spectacular area and keep our waters and water supply clean.
The site is accessed via the North Fork road off Hwy 50 at Maysville, and high clearence vehicles can drive to the work site. There are numerous ways for all abilities and skill levels to assist with this project.
Yeh they want us wheelers to carry their tools!

[ZooMad75]

I'm glad I wasn't given a line of bull from the atv'er then. He was from Fountain, but is a regular up there. Before we went up there this latest time I took the liberty of calling the FS at the Salida office and they were pretty positive that everything that was still open. Then this goofy bob character is up there with his quite buddies closing trails down.

That's what had the atv'er we talked to so pissed off. Most of the trails up there are marked, known FS or county roads that have been there for a very long time. I would think to legally shut down either would require public notice, or other types of discussion.

I agree that it's going to take efforts of the 4x4 crowd and the atv crowd to come together and adopt the trails in the area.

[Red_Chili]

If the story about Ranger Bob is true, he can be terminated by the USFS or at least reassigned. Escalate it to the district.

If he is impersonating a ranger, but is not one, he can be cited.

FWIW, the district is the same district that worked to give us back Iron Chest. So verify it.

[ZooMad75]

If I manage to squeeze some time out later I'll see if I can get a call up to the salida office. Now I'm really curious to find out if "bob" is a real FS ranger or pretending to be one. We might need the ATV rental place to provide the proof of which trails were marked closed by Bob and his buddies.

[Roy]

Watch this "Quite Coalition". One of their objectivies is to get congress to allow bicycles in wilderness areas. It might be effective to flood the forest service office with calls opposing these closures. If someone gets a number to the right forest service offce post it here for others to use.

[REDBULL]

O.K. I just called down to the Salida Ranger District Office (719) 539-3591 and talked to Ann Ewing. She was very helpful in clearing up some of these rumors. First off, "Ranger Bob" is definitely a legit employee of the forest service. Ann said that he has no affiliation with the Quiet coalition or anyone else that is secretly closing trails. As far as she knows, he hasn't even been up Grizzly this year at all. Do you guys know if there was a carsonite sign by the closures or not? When I was up there earlier this year I saw the rocks blocking the trail, but I do not remember if there were forest service signs or not. She said if there is no sign, then it is not their closure. Also, camping is allowed within 100 feet of the main trail as long as you aren't driving across mud bogs and so fourth (use common sense). She is going to ask around and find out if anyone out of their office is responsible for the closures and call me back this week....

I hope this sheds a little light on the situation up there. I have been camping up there for 5 years and I was upset that ALL the camping spots had been closed as well. You pretty much have to park on the road and walk your stuff in to any of the good campsites, which kinda sucks. I'll follow up with any info that I find out!!

Aaron

[mrladewig]

Watch this "Quite Coalition". One of their objectivies is to get congress to allow bicycles in wilderness areas. It might be effective to flood the forest service office with calls opposing these closures. If someone gets a number to the right forest service offce post it here for others to use.

While I think that the exclusion of bicycles from wilderness areas was absurd and agree that they should be allowed in, I don't think that is what this group is aiming to do. From reading their home page I couldn't find anything suggesting that they are trying to open access to wilderness areas for bicycles. But I could find plenty about closing access to ATVs, Jetskis, snomobiles and dirt bikes. Apparently they think it is OK to let traditional 4X4 vehicles continue to drive limited roads since they wouldn't be able to reach their places for "quiet traditional recreation" without hopping in their 4-runners.

Typical outdoors group crap. They are happy to bad mouth and screw over another group of outdoorsmen while pushing their own agenda. Meanwhile the anti-recreation greens push closure after closure and succeed because these outdoorsmen are so busy pissing on each other. The same complaints about excess speed and quote "pulverization or compaction of plants and soil" that they've made against motor vehicles can be and have been made against mountain bikes, which they support.

Mel-

[rockkrusher]

O.K. I just called down to the Salida Ranger District Office (719) 539-3591 and talked to Ann Ewing. She was very helpful in clearing up some of these rumors. First off, "Ranger Bob" is definitely a legit employee of the forest service. Ann said that he has no affiliation with the Quiet coalition or anyone else that is secretly closing trails. As far as she knows, he hasn't even been up Grizzly this year at all. Do you guys know if there was a carsonite sign by the closures or not? When I was up there earlier this year I saw the rocks blocking the trail, but I do not remember if there were forest service signs or not. She said if there is no sign, then it is not their closure. Also, camping is allowed within 100 feet of the main trail as long as you aren't driving across mud bogs and so fourth (use common sense). She is going to ask around and find out if anyone out of their office is responsible for the closures and call me back this week....

I hope this sheds a little light on the situation up there. I have been camping up there for 5 years and I was upset that ALL the camping spots had been closed as well. You pretty much have to park on the road and walk your stuff in to any of the good campsites, which kinda sucks. I'll follow up with any info that I find out!!

Aaron
I too talked to the salida FS after the 3rd person they did tell me that there were road closures at the lake due to resourse damage.The posted signs are the carsonite ones. As far as ranger bob goes that is all hearsay to me but there is alot of it.I will still continue to camp up there even if I have to walk a little bit from the road to set up.When I was up there last there was a group of 17 back packers with their tent city set up and were some of the loudest people I have ever come across up there.They were also taking pics of where people were parked in order for them to camp.That I saw for myself.

[Red_Chili]

I have found the Salida office to be very well balanced and not anti-recreation at all. The ranger I spoke with after we got Iron Chest back was very happy to hear from me, and stressed that they worked hard to make sure Iron Chest was not lost forever due to the state needing to research the mine up there.

If you like Spring Creek, you will like Iron Chest IMHO. A bit short, but a fine time. I did not run it before the temporary closure but I understand it is more safe than before, but nearly as challenging. The views and hikes at the top were spectacular.